1 - Marc-Andre ter Ansplant

zanela

Senior Member
What do these players have in common? All are Masia players. It's different with them because Barcelona is their home.

Instead, why don't you give me a recent example of a young player that came at the club, from outside, since an early age, while not being a great player already (so Neymar doesn't qualify), and made it big. Very very few.

Whether Barca was their home or not is secondary. The aforementioned players were young, and didn't hit the ground running. But the coach persisted with them. As for Neymar, he was a big marketable talent, but there was a lot of skepticism when he moved to Europe. I'm sure if you checked the Neymar thread, you will find many ppl showing reservations, most notably the leader of the pack, the honorable BBZ. Neymar took time to adapt and had to overcome his own struggles. I wouldn't say he was already GREAT as he's become today.
The difference between Neymar and MAtS' situation is not one of proven quality at the time of acquisition, but mostly about position they play. They were both talented youngsters. Only Neymar's poor spell of form, even extended ones, can be bore without having a negative impact overall but poor form or error from the keeper mostly proves fatal to the team.
 

arjunanand1

New member
You could do worse.:lol:

Bravo 40 games for Barca,20 goals conceded
Ter Stegen 6 games this year,15 goals conceded.

Though to be fair,Bravo had the luxury of playing with prime Puyol,Pique,Abidal and Rafa Marquez...poor Ter Stegen has played with an awful defense,one which magically turns awful with him on goal and then even more magically turns decent when Bravo is on goal.

Something fishy is going around...maybe Bravo has some pictures of Pique with Shakira and has blackmailed him and the defense to sabotage Ter Stegen.:lol: :lol:


Are you sure you are talking about Bravo there? He never played with any of the players you mentioned :lol:
 

serghei

Senior Member
Whether Barca was their home or not is secondary. The aforementioned players were young, and didn't hit the ground running. But the coach persisted with them. As for Neymar, he was a big marketable talent, but there was a lot of skepticism when he moved to Europe. I'm sure if you checked the Neymar thread, you will find many ppl showing reservations, most notably the leader of the pack, the honorable BBZ. Neymar took time to adapt and had to overcome his own struggles. I wouldn't say he was already GREAT as he's become today.
The difference between Neymar and MAtS' situation is not one of proven quality at the time of acquisition, but mostly about position they play. They were both talented youngsters. Only Neymar's poor spell of form, even extended ones, can be bore without having a negative impact overall but poor form or error from the keeper mostly proves fatal to the team.

Don't agree. First, Busquets had a very fast impact in the team. First season in and he was performing amazing, including in the clasico when he obtained the penalty Eto'o missed. Both Busi and Pedro had great first seasons. Busquets has a very good 2008-2009 season, that's why he played in front of Yaya Toure. Not because he was playing so-so, but the manager trusted him. I didn't see Busi playing like shit and still being trusted over Toure because he was young and promising. He earned his place. Something Stegen never did over Bravo, keep in mind.

About Neymar, some were skeptic. Not me. Neymar when he came at Barca was 2 times the player Stegen is now. That's why teams wanted him and were willing to pay crazy money to land him. Maybe the talent is the same in both, but Neymar as a player was more evolved than Stegen is now.

I don't see why different rules should apply to Ter Stegen. You're not good enough, you don't play. I'm not a fan of the idea that a player should be trusted in important games in order to develop him, and least of all a goalkeeper. Other teams develop players, we usually buy them, unless we are talking about Masia players. PSG developed Ronaldinho, Mallorca developed Eto'o, Sevilla developed Alves, Monaco developed Giuly, Lyon developed Abidal and the list goes on and on. We are not the kind of team to use players that are not ready in important games in order to develop them. Arsenal is that kind of team. Not us. Our policy in recent times has been buying top players to fill the spots for which La Masia could not provide us with class options. We thought that Stegen is that top player, but as it turned out, it's actually Claudio Bravo.

Some even said at the begining of the season that Stegen should play La Liga instead of Bravo, a few weeks after Bravo captained Chile to a record Copa America campaign. :lol: What was that? It's like saying Rafinha needs to start instead of Iniesta, because he is the future. We are Barca, we live in the present. Whoever is the best should play. I don't care if that person is a 35 years old Iniesta or a 35 years old Bravo.
 
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Science Kid

Member
Are you sure you are talking about Bravo there? He never played with any of the players you mentioned :lol:

Sarcasm bud :cheers: When Ter Stegen plays and concedes like crazy,it's excusable because he has a terrible defense in front of him.When Bravo plays with the same defense we rarely if ever concede,so i guess we all have been blind and Bravo actually plays with Puyol,etc...which explains the discrepancy between our defensive performances.

Otherwise we have to conclude Ter Stegen is not very good :lol:
 

zanela

Senior Member
Don't agree. First, Busquets had a very fast impact in the team. First season in and he was performing amazing, including in the clasico when he obtained the penalty Eto'o missed. Both Busi and Pedro had great first seasons. Busquets has a very good 2008-2009 season, that's why he played in front of Yaya Toure. Not because he was playing so-so, but the manager trusted him. I didn't see Busi playing like shit and still being trusted over Toure because he was young and promising. He earned his place. Something Stegen never did over Bravo, keep in mind.


Immediate impact? That's not how I remember it. His back headers were leading to opp. goals (even in his sec season). He had some good games but he was inconsistent in his first season. At Stamford bridge, Busi went missing, and Xavi had to do heavy duty as a consequence. He did have run of poor games but Pep's vision and patience with him came trumps. Talent without proper management and guidance will never get far.

About Neymar, some were skeptic. Not me. Neymar when he came at Barca was 2 times the player Stegen is now. That's why teams wanted him and were willing to pay crazy money to land him. Maybe the talent is the same in both, but Neymar as a player was more evolved than Stegen is now.

Gks evolve at a slower rate than outfield players. So that ain't a surprise. But Neymar being a great player was never a consensus, and he did suffer through his acclimatization. A keeper in his early twenties moving to a new country/league will always have a harder adaptation period (see DDG, Courtois) than players in other positions.

I don't see why different rules should apply to Ter Stegen. You're not good enough, you don't play. I'm not a fan of the idea that a player should be trusted in important games in order to develop him, and least of all a goalkeeper. Other teams develop players, we usually buy them, unless we are talking about Masia players. PSG developed Ronaldinho, Mallorca developed Eto'o, Sevilla developed Alves, Monaco developed Giuly, Lyon developed Abidal and the list goes on and on. We are not the kind of team to use players that are not ready in important games in order to develop them. Arsenal is that kind of team. Not us. Our policy in recent times has been buying top players to fill the spots for which La Masia could not provide us with class options. We thought that Stegen is that top player, but as it turned out, it's actually Claudio Bravo.

I'm not advocating that he plays important games, and I don't think anyone is anymore. To the contrary.

Some even said at the begining of the season that Stegen should play La Liga instead of Bravo, a few weeks after Bravo captained Chile to a record Copa America campaign. :lol: What was that? It's like saying Rafinha needs to start instead of Iniesta, because he is the future. We are Barca, we live in the present. Whoever is the best should play. I don't care if that person is a 35 years old Iniesta or a 35 years old Bravo.

MAtS and Rafinha aren't comparable. One was a regular starter in two of the three comps which Barca won, the other was amongst the supporting cast. Wanting MatS be given a shot in La liga wasn't such a preposterous wish at the time as it may look now.
 
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DonAK

President of FC Barcelona
The way things are going right now, with Bravo rumoured to play in both the League and CL, he's for sure gonna get loaned or ask for a permanent transfer in January/Summer.

The onus is on the club to find the best club to loan him, if they mess up, he'll leave for sure.
 

Ini8

¡Gr?*cies Xavi!
Poll: "Nolito's 1-0 was a great goal or a mistake?" Great goal by Nolito 51% - Mistake by Ter Stegen 49% #fcblive (3757 votes) [md]

We got ourselves a new scapegoat.
 

KingMessi

SiempreBlaugrana
Poll: "Nolito's 1-0 was a great goal or a mistake?" Great goal by Nolito 51% - Mistake by Ter Stegen 49% #fcblive (3757 votes) [md]

We got ourselves a new scapegoat.

We have one or two or three every year. It's just how we roll.
 

mdenci

Member
I believe that we have not made a mistake by buying MAtS. Of course, as any young goalkeeper he has his fluctuations in form, but he has made it clear in his last season Champion's League matches that he is a big talent that has yet to shine in full light. I myself am a GK and I know that a young GK is sometimes clumsy and insecure GK. I'm 25 years old now and I'm starting to notice that I am calmer in certian situations (not that our level of competition are anywhere near the same, but I can relate to him in terms of age and experience), so I guess that we just have to trust him and let him develop at his natural pace...
Just a reminder, David de Gea also had a lot of unfortunate reactions that led to funny goals and everybody made fun of sir Alex Ferguson's singing, but look at him now, a beast between bars.
 

arjunanand1

New member
Sarcasm bud :cheers: When Ter Stegen plays and concedes like crazy,it's excusable because he has a terrible defense in front of him.When Bravo plays with the same defense we rarely if ever concede,so i guess we all have been blind and Bravo actually plays with Puyol,etc...which explains the discrepancy between our defensive performances.

Otherwise we have to conclude Ter Stegen is not very good :lol:

It was rather late when I read your post. And the sarcasm completely flew over my head :D. Note to self: do not read barcaforum late at night :lol:
 

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